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johnjones
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Joined: 14 Nov 2009
Posts: 27

PostPosted: Thu May 20, 2010 3:43 am    Post subject: Disconnects Reply with quote

Scott

I know this has been discussed before but can I raise the issue again but with a new idea? I was wondering if we can be a bit cleverer with the disconnect rule? See my game below with wish.

http://game.warfareincorporated.com/stats/gamedetail?g=k30-4be0534a-00005ee6

No offence intended to wish but I was clearly winning (I had 100 units remaining to his 14) when I lost my broadband connection. It seems a bit harsh that I lost points. I'm not suggesting I should pick up points, but it's a bit harsh that I lose them. Perhaps the rule could be that if the person disconnected has more than double (or maybe triple) the number of units remaining to the total number of his opposition (may be more than 1 oppo), then the game will not be scored.

Some of us can't help living in parts of the world where internet connections are rubbish. As I improve and my ranking goes up, I'm punished more harshly for disconnects. My disconnects occur due to old and dodgy telecoms in my neighbourhood so not a lot I can do, I have a brand new top of the range router!

Thanks
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galm
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Joined: 18 Oct 2009
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Location: New York

PostPosted: Thu May 20, 2010 4:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That double thing sounds good double the buildings wmight be good too.
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Jack van java
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Joined: 04 Apr 2010
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Location: Valencia

PostPosted: Thu May 20, 2010 7:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had this problem 100 times. I think the best idea is to make the 20 sec to 30 sec. After the 30 sec u can dc.
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kilik8880
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Joined: 21 Oct 2009
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PostPosted: Thu May 20, 2010 9:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

that is a very good idea but maybe instead of just units it could also be decided with buildings destroyed/remaining
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scottlu
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Joined: 15 Aug 2003
Posts: 1773

PostPosted: Thu May 20, 2010 11:11 am    Post subject: Re: Disconnects Reply with quote

johnjones wrote:
Scott

I know this has been discussed before but can I raise the issue again but with a new idea? I was wondering if we can be a bit cleverer with the disconnect rule? See my game below with wish.

http://game.warfareincorporated.com/stats/gamedetail?g=k30-4be0534a-00005ee6

No offence intended to wish but I was clearly winning (I had 100 units remaining to his 14) when I lost my broadband connection. It seems a bit harsh that I lost points. I'm not suggesting I should pick up points, but it's a bit harsh that I lose them. Perhaps the rule could be that if the person disconnected has more than double (or maybe triple) the number of units remaining to the total number of his opposition (may be more than 1 oppo), then the game will not be scored.

Some of us can't help living in parts of the world where internet connections are rubbish. As I improve and my ranking goes up, I'm punished more harshly for disconnects. My disconnects occur due to old and dodgy telecoms in my neighbourhood so not a lot I can do, I have a brand new top of the range router!

Thanks


You're asking that the server make a judgement call. It has to be close to 100% sure of this judgement call - I don't want the server to have logic that awards wins incorrectly. The question is, is triple the units good enough? Because there can be tactical situations where you'll lose even if you have triple the units.

As far as the 20 vs. 30 second timeout, I've just made that change and it'll go into the next server update (expected this weekend).

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kilik8880
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Joined: 21 Oct 2009
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PostPosted: Thu May 20, 2010 11:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

well if the jugement call is made on multiple integers such as buildings destroyed buidings still intact unit difference etc. the decision will be fair 100% of the time
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johnjones
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PostPosted: Thu May 20, 2010 2:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm not suggesting the server picks a winner from games, I'm suggesting it doesn't score games where clearly someone has not disconnected on purpose tactically.

If you want to be certain, add a minimum number of units to the equation e.g. 40.

The reason the current rule is there is to stop people disconnecting when they are losing. I'm suggesting we come up with a formula where we can be so certain someone is winning that the server can be sure they haven't left on purpose. Even then we don't award a win we award a no score. Surely that will make fewer wrong calls than awarding losses for all disconnects. It might not be perfect but it is an improvement on current which can be very unfair in a lot of situations.

If someone can tell me of a scenario where someone could have 40 units to an opposition's 13 and then disconnect on purpose to avoid being beaten then we should forget the idea, but I just can't think of a situation that might happen.

Whatever equation is used it has to be better than awarding a win to someone with 14 units to the oppo's 100 as what happened today with current method.

I'm not sure about the building idea because buildings are generally the last things to be destroyed. So building counts can be quite level, even if someone is being thrashed.

If you want put money into the equation, that's fine, the equation is not that critical, let's just not award wins in situations where someone is clearly getting pasted.
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scottlu
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Joined: 15 Aug 2003
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PostPosted: Thu May 20, 2010 3:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I see what you're saying. That is a clever way to think about it.

I like that. Let me think about it overnight.

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galm
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Joined: 18 Oct 2009
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Location: New York

PostPosted: Thu May 20, 2010 3:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah John jones is right it would help alot.
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johnjones
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PostPosted: Fri May 21, 2010 1:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry one more post from me (I realise I'm getting boring). Some further ideas:

Currently disconnects happen independently of who is winning so you have a 50% chance of an unfair disconnect.

If we can take out 20% of the games where someone is clearly winning, your chance of an unfair disconnect goes down to 40% (half of the remaining 80%). Even if, out of those 20% of games the server takes out, it gets a quarter wrong, that is only 5% of total games so you have a 45% chance of suffering an injustice during a disconnect (40% of the time you will lose points unfairly, 5% of the time you will not get points when you should have). i.e. still better than current 50%.

You only need a rule that works 51% of the time to improve the current situation i.e. it doesn't have to be perfect.

If you make the rule more strict like triple units, you will take out less games but the server will make less wrong decisions. If you make it less strict like double units it will make more wrong decisions but take out more games. So it's a balance. I guess a way of judging how to balance is looking at past games and seeing at what sort of unit ratios people tend to resign and basing it around that. Is this something you can query in the database Scott?

That's enough from me, I'm frying my brain before I even start work.
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kilik8880
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Joined: 21 Oct 2009
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PostPosted: Fri May 21, 2010 9:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lets not do that john we dont want u to get fired -/Smile
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LawrenceA
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Joined: 15 Feb 2010
Posts: 1135
Location: New Zealand

PostPosted: Fri May 21, 2010 8:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm not gonna bother making a new topic for this but i just saw that there is a 3rd server called Cyclops, What is the point of this if we don't use the river bends one?†
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trineroks
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Joined: 16 Oct 2009
Posts: 1769
Location: Southern Cali (UCLA)

PostPosted: Sat May 22, 2010 8:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

cyclops is down now. It was an expiremental server to try new crap on
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LawrenceA
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PostPosted: Sat May 22, 2010 3:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, if I'd waited a couple more seconds I wouldn't have made that post Smile
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